Castration in Medieval Times-Horses

[celia]

The horses on the BT appear to be intact.

From those A/S charters that I have studied in detail

studs and seperate fields for mares and stallions
are a common feature. Indeed I can't even bring
to mind the Old English word for 'gelding'.
Is this another example of the 'class' system
in horses or was gelding rare ?

Celia

[David Read]

Post by celia
The horses on the BT appear to be intact.

From those A/S charters that I have studied in detail

studs and seperate fields for mares and stallions
are a common feature. Indeed I can't even bring
to mind the Old English word for 'gelding'.
Is this another example of the 'class' system
in horses or was gelding rare ?

The practice of gelding was rare in Western Europe until the 16th century.
At least, it was rare for warhorses and good quality riding horses. Geldings
destined for work in draught harness and as pack animals might have been
more commonly found, if less commonly recorded, but their biggest economic
competitiors would have been sterile mules and oxen.

--

cheers,

David Read

[celia]

Thanks, You're a genius at horse history,
I should have thought of mules, more power
per inch of animal therefore better value.

Celia

[David Read]

Post by celia
Thanks, You're a genius at horse history,
I should have thought of mules, more power
per inch of animal therefore better value.
Celia

You're welcome, and much too kind. I'm usually quite immune to flattery, but
don't let that stop you.

Straight from the horse's mouth, as it were.

--

cheers,

David Read

[Paul J Gans]

Post by celia
The horses on the BT appear to be intact.

From those A/S charters that I have studied in detail

studs and seperate fields for mares and stallions
are a common feature. Indeed I can't even bring
to mind the Old English word for 'gelding'.
Is this another example of the 'class' system
in horses or was gelding rare ?

I think not. But war horses were kept intact
on purpose. The knight and his horse were a
unified fighting machine and a *really* angry
intact male horse could be quite formidable.

On the other hand, the Arabs seem to have
preferred mares as being more docile and easier
to handle in difficult situations.

But I could be misremembering that bit.

---- Paul J. Gans

[celia]

the Arabs seem to have preferred mares

Reminds me of an old Arab saying,

"The wind from heaven is that which blows between
a horse's ears."

Unfortunately thats not the wind that you get
when driving them.

Celia

[Peter Jason]

Post by celia

the Arabs seem to have preferred mares

Reminds me of an old Arab saying,
"The wind from heaven is that which blows
between
a horse's ears."
Unfortunately thats not the wind that you
get
when driving them.
Celia

Maybe Lady Godiva's stallion was gelded.
What a relief!

[k***@cix.compulink.co.uk]

Post by Paul J Gans
and a *really* angry
intact male horse could be quite formidable.

Not medieval but... One Egyptian Pharaoh was said to be out
numbered by the enemy chariot force which use stallions. The
pharaoh sent some mares in heat forward, reducing the enemy
forces to chaos.

Ken Young

[celia]

Post by k***@cix.compulink.co.uk
sent some mares in heat forward, reducing the
enemy forces to chaos

Loved the story. It was much that problem
that made me wonder about gelding.
Not a problem in winter but from the geography
of my own area where the battlegrounds were
land that was flooded in winter I had assumed that warfare
was seasonal but coming to think of it that was guesswork.
Its not just stallions that can't keep their mind on the
correct job; my first mare was a shameless hussy
who would go to the fence of the geldings field
and flirt outrageously whenever in season.

Celia

[a425couple]

Post by k***@cix.compulink.co.uk

and a *really* angry intact male horse could be quite formidable.

Not medieval but... One Egyptian Pharaoh was said to be out
numbered by the enemy chariot force which use stallions. The
pharaoh sent some mares in heat forward, reducing the enemy
forces to chaos. > Ken Young

OK, I'm ignorant re: horses, but willing to be informed.
How disruptive would that really be to a formation of horses:
1. In harness pulling under orders in formation?
2. Mounted and directed by it's regular rider in formation?

[David Read]

Post by a425couple

Post by k***@cix.compulink.co.uk

and a *really* angry intact male horse could be quite formidable.

Not medieval but... One Egyptian Pharaoh was said to be out
numbered by the enemy chariot force which use stallions. The
pharaoh sent some mares in heat forward, reducing the enemy
forces to chaos. > Ken Young

OK, I'm ignorant re: horses, but willing to be informed.
1. In harness pulling under orders in formation?
2. Mounted and directed by it's regular rider in formation?

"Choosing animals with the right mix of temperamant and intelligence must
have been one of the hardest of the stablemaster's tasks. One characteristic
desirablre in a cavalry charger and highly undesirable in a mount for a
civilian was aggression, albeit manageable aggression. Varro is very
explicit on this, as we have seen: 'For just as we need them high spirited
for camps so we prefer to have them quiet on the road. Castration affects
this' (_de Re Rust.). This raises the very important question of the sex for
cavalry mounts. It need not be thought that stallions would have been
unsuitable because of the potential nuisance value of disruptive behaviour,
and that in consequence males would be castrated. Certainly castration was
used by certain tribes, and the geographer Strabo (_Geog_, 7.4.8) comments
on the Sarmatians and Scythians having the *peculiarity* of gelding to make
their horses easy to manage. Ammianus Marcellinus, several centuries later
(_Res Gest. 17.12), also comments on this practice of the Sarmatians and
Quadi, saying it was to prevent stallions bolting at the sight of mares, or
betraying their presence in an ambush by neighing. Some stallions are
extremely noisy, others as quiet as any other horse. (My own stallion
Nizzolan whuffles politely and quietly with his mares, others almost roar,
the neigh is so loud,) From all this. however, it is very clear that gelding
was not the norm for the army in Roman times. There is also sufficient
evidence from carvings that stallions were used, as the full complement of
equipment may be seen!"

Ann Hyland, _Equus: The Horse in the Roman World_ , Yale, 1990. p.80

--

cheers,

David Read

[k***@cix.compulink.co.uk]

Post by a425couple
1. In harness pulling under orders in formation?
2. Mounted and directed by it's regular rider in formation?

Stallions tend to fight over mares. Like most herding herbivores
they have to establish a dominant male who is the only one who
gets to breed. On the other hand some of the medieval bits would
definitely take their minds off anything but their mouth. Far
more vicious than anything the RSPCA would allow today.

Ken Young